194: MoneyTalks #55: FTX and Visa | Google Cloud Goes Crypto | Mumsnet and Community Fintech | Public Fintech Utilities | Meta’s Metaverse Mess

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Hey there, I'm Pete Townsend,
and this is money, never sleeps.

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We look inside the minds of
entrepreneurs, and at the

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crossover of startups,
Enterprise Finance, technology

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and Life.
As We Know It, This episode of

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money.
Never sleeps is sponsored by

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security.
Centrex security, Centrex is a

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trusted cyber security company.
With offices, in Dublin, Cape

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Town, in London, security.
Tetrax provides expert advisory

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Services.
Primarily in the finance and fin

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Tech Industries with tailored
Security Solutions to fit your

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specific needs and Regulatory
challenges in this episode.

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All in Fitzgerald, my Riff on
crypto exchange FTX in their

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partnership with Visa enabling
users to spend crypto.

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Anywhere Visa is accepted.
We also dig into how Google

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cloud or opening up to crypto
payments in partnership with

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coinbase.
We look at the state of

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community fintech Through the
lens of Chetwood financials deal

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with mumsnet in their eight
million strong.

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We also look at Nova credits,
Big 10 million dollar investment

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from HSBC is a rallying cry for
Public fintech Utilities.

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We also look at the latest on
metas metaverse world and

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finally it's backs against the
wall time for Goldman Sachs has

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Marcus and Banknorth.
All right here on money.

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Never sleeps.
Hey, Owen a piece.

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How you doing tonight?
Yeah, wonderful.

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And this, lovely Wednesday
evening.

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Yeah.
Yeah.

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You tired at all today?
How how is today?

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I'm very tired.
Yeah.

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And month, almost 11 months.
Old has not grasped the concept

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of sleeping at night if I
imagine more awake at night.

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So my what would I call him?
Now my 120 months old.

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He didn't sleep till he was
twenty six months and it it's

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something he remembered how fun
that was over the summer and I

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did teach him a few things to
calm his mind that I learned

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from doing this positive
intelligence course called PQ

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that I did with sure Zod.
Shh mean actually, it was Paul

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Smith, shout out to Paul from
Top tier Recruitment and from

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possible that IE who introduced
me to this and brought me

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through the course but these
little techniques that you can

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use to quiet your brain such as
and that they're kind of

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meditation techniques, which is
breathe in through your Those

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breathe out through your nose,
breathe in, through your nose,

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feel the temperature, the air is
enters your nostrils, and then

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feel the temperature of the air
as it exits, your nostrils,

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right?
And then rub your finger

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together, your thumb and your
forefinger just so gently that

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you can feel the riches of your
fingers and just concentrate on

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that.
That's way too quiet your brain.

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So don't think you can teach
that to Sebastian, just yet know

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when he's 120 months old, he may
be ready for that might help.

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Yeah.
Somebody help for me when I'm

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trying not to be frustrated in
the middle of nice.

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Yeah, nose listen to Brian
Armstrong, talk about this to

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Tim Ferriss on his latest
episode.

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Tim Ferriss show and talking
about you know, waking up in the

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middle of the night rolling
around thinking about stuff.

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And I'm like, yeah, I know that.
But thanks to shoe Sasha mean,

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and Paul Smith and PQ of kind of
learned a little bit of way to

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quiet.
My brain know, I talked to Brian

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McNulty about this as well from
fun admin chain and I'm like

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that ever happens like, yeah,
dude, I'm so over it.

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Like, you got to figure that
out.

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There's ways to do this.
Get yourself back to sleep.

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Come on.
Just Like okay so we figured it

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out go up shout out to Bryant as
well but listen where we're

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going to start this week.
We've got FTX.

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We talked about Sam Bank been
freed last week.

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He's a CEO of FTX comes from a
Quant trading background with

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Alameda research.
Obviously the big crypto player

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and they are partnering with the
VISA in a bet that Shoppers

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still want to spend
cryptocurrencies in a bear

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Market.
That is, this was on CNBC on the

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7th of Tobar effectively, what's
happening is that FTX are

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launching a debit card whereby
you could spend cryptocurrency.

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I think the way that it works, I
only saw this in one other

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article was that whatever your
highest balance is across

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different cryptocurrencies,
whether that be Bitcoin theorem

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or even stable coins, like we
talked about USD, see it will

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automatically go to that balance
and will debit for you.

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Now, the merchant doesn't get
paid in crypto.

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It's that behind the scenes visa
and ft x, or converting that

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From crypto into Fiat into, you
know, traditional currency that

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can float through the credit
card debit card payment networks

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with Visa.
Mastercard has been doing a bit

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around this as well.
So I think it's, you know,

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there's reading into this a bit,
there's a little Latin America

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play here.
There's an inflation Play.

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And unbanked play in that, it's
far, easier for, and I've been,

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because I've been digging into
this big time with techstars

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helping out getting the the
Legos program off the ground.

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And seeing how many systematic
infrastructure in efficiencies

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are in Nigeria.
For example, with how much

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fintech is coming out of that
market, and that there are just,

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you know, so mobile money while
it's become a huge thing in

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Nigeria and West Africa in
general, because of just how

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hard it can be to get a bank
account and how unreliable the

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banking infrastructure can be.
So go that even a step further.

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It's like anybody can open up
and FTX account, anybody can

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open up a coinbase account and
that you Then, well, you got to

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populate that account, right?
You gotta get some type of

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financial balance in there, in
order to move from Fiat into

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crypto.
But if someone just sends you

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say, 1/100 of a Bitcoin, you can
then convert that to USD, see

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you can elect to be paid by
someone that you're providing a

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service for and u.s.
DC.

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And then holding USD see in
countries where the local

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currency Is less than stable is
something that can be quite

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helpful to you, in your quest,
to move up the ladder and to

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start saving and growing it,
preserving your wealth and

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moving up even further into
improving your quality of life.

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Right?
So I think there's a play here

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that is perhaps moving ft x more
into kind of the coinbase

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territory of coin basis vision
of creating it open Financial

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system for the world and that
you know with with just as I

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mentioned just listening to It
Brian Armstrong, the CEO of

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coinbase, on the, Tim Ferriss
podcast this week and talking

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about is initial journey and
Argentina.

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And thinking about how people
got paid and how difficult it

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was for people to get into the
financial system.

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It's like just make it open and
create these opportunities for

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people.
So like you always say it's good

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to see right that the FTX
removing this direction.

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Yeah.
And it's like, I mean, it seems

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like a no-brainer in a sense.
So for some of these markets,

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you know, I know from the
article der talking about places

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like Argentina and so if they
Eighty-three percent inflation.

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And but the reality is, when
you've a lot of people using,

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like I said, mobile wallets and
that's how they're living going

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about their daily life.
Well, you know, this is another

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extension, it's a, you know, if
they're not good payment,

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infrastructure payment rails in
a market.

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Well then these types of
products are ideal, you know,

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from an adoption point of view.
So it seems like a fairly easy

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way in that sense for a visa to
partner with the like 7 ft x and

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you know, at least get some
element to scale then and you

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know, It's a good entry strategy
are from the outside anyway.

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It looks like it would have you
then to be able to do more.

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Yeah.
Absolute move article.

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Also said that obviously
MasterCard has been on a similar

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spree partnering with coinbase
on end of T's and backed to let

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Banks and Merchants in its
Network.

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After offer crypto related
services and Max American

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Express are also exploring
connecting its cards.

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A network was stable coins, so
it's all about getting the

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unbanked.
To some type of digital money

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mode right now and whether that
is through a mobile wallet,

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whether that is through crypto,
there needs to be some on-ramp

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in and I think that is still
going to be the struggle.

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Now, our friends at Pitt Ali,
Walsh are working on this and

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have been working on this for
years which is digitalizing cash

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and enabling you to take your
cash that you've earned somehow

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you've been paid cash and and
hand that in to somebody who

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will convert that into a
message, that will be sent over

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whether that be crypto rails or
traditional rails, to the end

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party, right?
And that end party can be your

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mobile money wallet.
So, this is a pretty popular

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thing to use in Nigeria in Ghana
in Western Africa, in general,

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where you do have cash and you
want to actually get that into a

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mobile money wallet.
Well, let's get that from

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instead of cash into a mobile
money wallet.

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Cash into a crypto wallet.
I know pit have been able to

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enable some things like that,
with some of the partners are

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working on so it's all about the
on.

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Ramps are still one point
billion unbanked in the world

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and it they don't necessarily
need to move into the

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traditional banking system in
order to move money around the

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world preserve and grow their
wealth.

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Help out family, friends, and
loved ones in need with a, or

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whoever.
When you have money, and they

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need money, or they have money,
do you need money?

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So, money makes the world go
round.

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And, you know what money never
sleeps, Val, memorize.

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All right.
So, next one, I had Google

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partnering with coinbase to
accept crypto payments, for

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cloud services.
I love this one, right?

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And this is where obviously so
much of the startup world.

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And let's look at crypto
startups web, three startups

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rely on AWS, right?
And it, that is Just leading

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cloud provider.
You can spin up a business using

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AWS to get your infrastructure.
Sack going wonderful, we have

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Microsoft Azure in there.
We have Google cloud obviously,

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that's what we're talking about
here.

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Any other big cloud players out
there besides Google Microsoft

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Oracle have something to, as
well, I think, but it may not be

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as big problem.
Big no.

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Yeah.
So I, uh, I have this

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conversation with startup
Founders and web three all the

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time.
It's like, kinda get a bank

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account, such a hassle.
We're already paying Paying our

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employees and stable coins,
we're paying them in u.s.

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DC and they're happy.
We have a crypto wallet.

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We received our funding from VCS
in crypto in u.s.

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DC, right?
A stable coin and why the hell

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do we need a bank account?
And we're going to actually be

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able to pay our expenses besides
paying our employees will build

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a expenses in stable coins.
So great now, Google Cloud are

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saying that, yes, start up when
you are using Google Google

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cloud and paying for services,
you can pay us in crypto.

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So I think this is A excellent
step forward by Google together

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with coinbase obviously, to make
it even easier for startups to

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operate, right?
Because being able to do so,

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without having a traditional
bank account can be, you know,

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really helpful.
Now it depends on.

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Obviously what name are they
setting up their crypto wallet

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under is this, the founder is
this the business.

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It's harder to get a business
account, say at coinbase than it

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is to get a personal account.
Do you have all the controls?

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There and the transparency is
you would have around a bank

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account to make sure this is a
company account that there are

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authorization requirements that
it can't just be one individual

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that then you know controls the
purse strings, right?

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00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:35,500
Which is a situation that you
don't want all those controls

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and and options are there to do
that.

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It's just making sure that
you're putting that right admin

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the governance in place, right?
So, you know, I was thrilled to

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see Google stepping forward and
doing that no, and you know

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what, it follows on from the
conversation, we were just

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having your own ft x that gets
the more widespread Option even

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around the fringes.
Well, then the better and like

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that, you end up in a scenario
where potentially everything

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00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:01,500
happens around and without the
traditional banking system and

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00:12:01,500 --> 00:12:04,300
you can raise your money in u.s.
DC or whatever and you can pay

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00:12:04,300 --> 00:12:07,000
our staff in coins and then all
of a sudden.

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So it's just if you know, use
you want to see more of that

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00:12:11,100 --> 00:12:13,300
because it will then have to
someone will have to make a

227
00:12:13,300 --> 00:12:15,000
decision.
So like it's great to see this

228
00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:16,400
and obviously with Google and
with ease.

229
00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:18,400
And the other example, because
the more and more traditional

230
00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:20,700
players that start allowing it,
well, then order.

231
00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:23,000
Thursday should hopefully drag
the rest of the market along.

232
00:12:24,100 --> 00:12:29,500
Yeah yeah and I think it's, you
know, people always say well why

233
00:12:29,500 --> 00:12:32,500
USD?
And I'm not sure if I shared

234
00:12:32,500 --> 00:12:35,500
this before with our listeners
because I've been saying it a

235
00:12:35,500 --> 00:12:40,600
lot lately is that recent stats
released by a trustworthy party.

236
00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:43,600
I don't remember who something
news outlet that 25 percent of

237
00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,900
the world's GDP comes out of the
United States of America, which

238
00:12:46,900 --> 00:12:51,300
is obviously denominated in USD
85% of the world's commercial

239
00:12:51,300 --> 00:12:53,600
transactions are denominated in
USD.

240
00:12:54,100 --> 00:12:56,600
So, it's currency especially
with what's going on in the

241
00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:59,200
world right now.
That is looked at is saying,

242
00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:01,400
okay, that's pretty safe, you
know?

243
00:13:01,500 --> 00:13:05,200
So it is easily transferable.
It is reliable.

244
00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,900
It is stable.
You know for now you know my

245
00:13:08,900 --> 00:13:12,100
views on the US have changed
quite a bit since I left 22

246
00:13:12,100 --> 00:13:14,000
years ago, but I don't need to
get into that tonight.

247
00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:17,700
Do I know?
No, I don't.

248
00:13:17,700 --> 00:13:21,000
I don't so yeah.
That was another notable one

249
00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,700
that I was thrilled to see.
I know.

250
00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:26,800
Oh, that you had a couple that
you had picked up on that.

251
00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:29,200
You wanted to take into?
Yeah, yes.

252
00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:30,500
I'm just trying to find it
again.

253
00:13:30,500 --> 00:13:33,500
So this was an interesting one,
so this is chatwood financial

254
00:13:33,500 --> 00:13:36,400
partners with mumsnet on Family,
Focus financial services.

255
00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:41,000
So Chetwood Financial is a UK.
Digital bank mumsnet is a large

256
00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:43,700
parenting Forum.
Most people are maybe their

257
00:13:43,700 --> 00:13:47,700
Partners might be more familiar
with to mumsnet as a source of

258
00:13:47,700 --> 00:13:50,000
information.
I know we look at a loss for

259
00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:52,600
uneaten, particularly when I
can't get a baby to sleep.

260
00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:55,400
Does it usually interested?
Fun to Mom's at Forum it.

261
00:13:55,500 --> 00:13:57,900
The reason this struck me as
interesting is because we've

262
00:13:57,900 --> 00:14:01,100
seen and I know it we probably
touch our later when we're

263
00:14:01,100 --> 00:14:03,800
talking about one of the other
ones but we've talked about, you

264
00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:07,700
know, Challenger Banks and the
opportunity and you know, where

265
00:14:07,700 --> 00:14:10,100
where is the opportunity and how
are some of them going to stand

266
00:14:10,100 --> 00:14:13,700
apart and the ones that seem to
have the stronger potential if

267
00:14:13,700 --> 00:14:17,500
you're not a revolute or mons or
big scale, it seems like you

268
00:14:17,500 --> 00:14:19,700
have a better opportunity if
you're going with a more

269
00:14:19,700 --> 00:14:23,500
specific Niche and like that.
This is a massive Community, I

270
00:14:23,508 --> 00:14:25,800
think.
There's a over 2 million people,

271
00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:28,800
kind of followers or whatever on
the mumsnet Forum.

272
00:14:29,300 --> 00:14:31,100
So we're talking about a big
community that.

273
00:14:31,100 --> 00:14:33,900
Now they're obviously partnering
with financial services provider

274
00:14:33,900 --> 00:14:36,900
to roll out solutions for their
members, you know?

275
00:14:36,900 --> 00:14:39,000
So really good move.
Obviously, for like to chat

276
00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:42,000
would, but obviously it brings
more and more value to that moms

277
00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,900
that forum and makes it wider
offering.

278
00:14:44,900 --> 00:14:47,300
So like that it's playing on the
community piece whereby, there

279
00:14:47,300 --> 00:14:50,700
is a captive audience already
who would use mumsnet for a lot

280
00:14:50,700 --> 00:14:54,000
of different things.
So yeah, the why isn't it?

281
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:58,300
That's interesting, don't don't
go there, don't go there.

282
00:14:58,900 --> 00:15:01,000
Go there.
Yeah, no no but you're right,

283
00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:03,800
it's reaching communities and
when you've got communities it

284
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,800
get behind something.
I mean we talked a couple weeks

285
00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:09,800
ago about T-Mobile partnering
with Goldman to reach their, you

286
00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,900
know, their retail, obviously,
their individual consumer

287
00:15:12,900 --> 00:15:18,000
Network and that is pretty wide
open theme that you're going

288
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:19,700
after while I have a Mobile
account.

289
00:15:19,700 --> 00:15:23,200
But when you are a mumsnet
follower, and This, you are

290
00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:26,500
actually, you know, part of this
community that actually is

291
00:15:26,500 --> 00:15:27,500
sorry.
I was wrong.

292
00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,300
Eight million unique monthly
users, okay?

293
00:15:30,300 --> 00:15:33,200
So one tenth of the T-Mobile
audience which is a pretty damn

294
00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:36,500
big audience training thousand
kind of posts every day.

295
00:15:37,700 --> 00:15:40,700
So you know, that's that's a big
deal to be able to roll out

296
00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,500
solutions to for both from both
sides.

297
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:46,000
You know chair it's an
interesting choice.

298
00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,400
Obviously chatwood Financial
wouldn't be one we'd be overly

299
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,400
familiar with over here but look
moms that is primarily UK

300
00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:53,500
focused.
This is a cost-of-living kind of

301
00:15:53,500 --> 00:15:57,500
play and having not support for
their members, but yeah, big big

302
00:15:57,500 --> 00:16:00,400
community of people.
Excellent.

303
00:16:00,500 --> 00:16:04,400
Now it's, you know, and where
you know, how much further can

304
00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:08,800
we go with Neil Banks digging
into certain themes, right.

305
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:13,700
So I just saw recently something
come back up for green light and

306
00:16:13,700 --> 00:16:16,300
what to green-light do?
They are a Neo back.

307
00:16:16,300 --> 00:16:19,700
They were on the fintech 250.
So CB insights release.

308
00:16:19,700 --> 00:16:22,800
Their fintech. 250 and green
light were on there.

309
00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:25,400
So they are a debit card for
kids and teens we might have

310
00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:27,500
talked about them before.
Oh yeah.

311
00:16:27,500 --> 00:16:31,700
Learn to Earn save in The kids
and teens banking app with

312
00:16:31,700 --> 00:16:35,700
investing.
So they were obviously being

313
00:16:35,700 --> 00:16:38,100
part of the CBN sites, fintech
250.

314
00:16:38,100 --> 00:16:40,900
And there's five, ten different
categories.

315
00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:45,800
Crypto lending Neil Banks Bank
as a service and infrastructure.

316
00:16:45,900 --> 00:16:50,000
So, you know, bunch of different
categories but the total amount

317
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:52,600
of companies they named in this
was 250.

318
00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:54,700
Interesting.
One now I won't get into that

319
00:16:56,300 --> 00:17:02,500
the so you've got this, we We
see them also coming up for

320
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,099
migrant Banks, right?
Yeah, in the USA like I've

321
00:17:07,099 --> 00:17:10,000
mentioned before stilt which is
the, my current lender raised a

322
00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:12,400
good chunk of money last 100
over 100 million last year to

323
00:17:12,408 --> 00:17:16,200
build out its or to broaden its
offering, you know, and they're

324
00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:19,200
specifically targeting
immigrants and a lending side.

325
00:17:19,500 --> 00:17:22,300
I know there are a number of
challenges banks in the u.s.

326
00:17:22,300 --> 00:17:24,400
targeting the African-American
Community as well.

327
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:27,500
And then there, I think there
was one launched recently which

328
00:17:27,500 --> 00:17:31,200
targeting Native Americans
Denise of American population as

329
00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:33,100
well.
So, you know, are they all going

330
00:17:33,100 --> 00:17:36,400
to survive, not necessarily but
in this example, you've got

331
00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:38,300
you've got 8 million monthly
users.

332
00:17:39,300 --> 00:17:41,600
You got a very big audience to
start rolling out something to

333
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:44,600
especially where it's trying to
be specific to that market or

334
00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:46,500
that audience?
Yep.

335
00:17:46,500 --> 00:17:48,700
The one I was thinking of was
majority right.

336
00:17:48,700 --> 00:17:51,900
That all-in-one, mobile banking
for migrants now, like I

337
00:17:51,900 --> 00:17:55,300
mentioned pit before and I lie
Walsh and they are, you know,

338
00:17:55,300 --> 00:17:58,200
they have released their new
connect, then you connect

339
00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:01,100
product, right?
Which Is moving, you know the

340
00:18:01,100 --> 00:18:05,300
whole migrant Financial
infrastructure or financial

341
00:18:05,300 --> 00:18:07,900
system.
Financial rails, really away

342
00:18:07,900 --> 00:18:11,500
from the traditional rails and
leveraging stable coin rails

343
00:18:11,500 --> 00:18:15,600
which is very quick rather than
waiting for 23 days.

344
00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:18,100
A day or two or three for money
to move through.

345
00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:19,600
The traditional banking
framework, right?

346
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:24,500
So to end up moving your cash
hand it over to a pay Point gets

347
00:18:24,500 --> 00:18:26,700
digitalized and moved into a
mobile money.

348
00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:28,600
While at that process can take a
couple of days.

349
00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:31,200
Why don't we just Leverage The
coins into that instantaneously,

350
00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:34,600
right?
So they're building a whole

351
00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:39,600
product set around this and
majority obviously working on

352
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,600
this in the US but it's a little
bit of a different story working

353
00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:46,900
on, migrant corridors from the
UK to say western Africa than it

354
00:18:46,900 --> 00:18:49,800
is working on the migrant
corridors from the u.s. to Latin

355
00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,300
America, right?
So there's you can see that by

356
00:18:52,300 --> 00:18:55,000
going down that kind of Niche
vertical, you know, you can

357
00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:58,600
offer more products than your if
you can work with them

358
00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:00,700
specifically.
You can then roll out additional

359
00:19:00,700 --> 00:19:02,700
product.
So it like I think that's where

360
00:19:02,700 --> 00:19:05,600
you'll see, you know, we'll see
lots of consolidation or

361
00:19:05,900 --> 00:19:09,100
businesses closing down in the
Neo banking space.

362
00:19:09,100 --> 00:19:11,000
But you probably should be the
ones that are survival.

363
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:15,000
Be the bigger ones or the ones
that are very specific on their

364
00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:17,100
target audience.
Yeah, yeah.

365
00:19:17,100 --> 00:19:21,500
And it's like, you know, moms
that in Ireland is revolute.

366
00:19:21,700 --> 00:19:24,000
Right.
So, you know, all the payments

367
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,300
going around for?
Well, we got to pay for this

368
00:19:26,300 --> 00:19:28,100
kid's party.
We got to pay for, you know,

369
00:19:28,100 --> 00:19:31,500
this group birthday party.
You know, school, you know,

370
00:19:31,700 --> 00:19:34,100
payments for this, that the
other thing, you know, it goes

371
00:19:34,100 --> 00:19:36,800
through revolute primarily right
now.

372
00:19:36,900 --> 00:19:40,300
So, you know, let's see if
Chetwood can step up and and do

373
00:19:40,300 --> 00:19:42,500
it better, right.
Cool.

374
00:19:42,700 --> 00:19:46,200
One of the other ones that you
wanted to talk about.

375
00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:48,100
I just saw something else
mentioned on them.

376
00:19:48,100 --> 00:19:50,100
So, so dive into this one.
Yeah.

377
00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:52,100
Oh yeah.
So this is Novick reddish.

378
00:19:52,100 --> 00:19:56,100
So obviously anyone regular
listeners and know I'm more than

379
00:19:56,100 --> 00:19:57,900
fascinated with the credit
world.

380
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:01,800
So, Nova credit, Our across our
position themselves as a

381
00:20:01,808 --> 00:20:03,700
cross-border kind of credit
bureau.

382
00:20:03,900 --> 00:20:07,700
So they have a their main
product is credit passport,

383
00:20:07,700 --> 00:20:11,500
which allows people moving to a
new country that, you know,

384
00:20:11,500 --> 00:20:14,400
won't have a credit history in
that new country to bring their

385
00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:16,100
previous kind of credit history
with them.

386
00:20:16,100 --> 00:20:19,100
So, they were really strong
coverage around.

387
00:20:19,300 --> 00:20:21,900
They launched 2016, their
relationships with about credit

388
00:20:21,900 --> 00:20:24,500
bureaus and about 20 countries,
and obviously, that's really

389
00:20:24,500 --> 00:20:26,800
beneficial for immigrants, but
not just immigrants.

390
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,400
Like, obviously, you moving from
the u.s. to Arland you.

391
00:20:29,500 --> 00:20:32,400
Had credit score.
You know, if I move to the UK

392
00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:35,200
next week, I'd have a history in
Ireland that I can't bring with

393
00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:38,300
me unless I'm using a product
like, Nova credit, under credit

394
00:20:38,300 --> 00:20:40,400
passport.
So nice, autumn, in the news

395
00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,400
I've seen the last two weeks
because HSBC had put ten million

396
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,500
dollars into them through HSB
Ventures.

397
00:20:47,300 --> 00:20:49,800
And I mean d list of things,
existing investors quite

398
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,400
impressive Kleiner, Perkins
General, Catalyst index

399
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,100
Ventures.
And then you've private

400
00:20:54,100 --> 00:20:57,700
individuals from Goldman, JP
Morgan and city of all put money

401
00:20:57,700 --> 00:21:00,700
into it.
So And quite significantly.

402
00:21:00,700 --> 00:21:03,600
And again, deepening its
relationships with the banks who

403
00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:06,200
would be its primary kind of
customers who are using the kind

404
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:08,500
of Novel credit platform.
So I thought it was really

405
00:21:08,500 --> 00:21:11,500
interesting.
Another bank put money into them

406
00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:15,200
and obviously HSBC are trying to
do more in Asia and that's where

407
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:17,000
they see the opportunity by
partnering with them.

408
00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,300
So an interesting one, it's a
big challenge, like we just

409
00:21:20,300 --> 00:21:22,900
talked about immigrants and you
know, this is another issue but

410
00:21:22,900 --> 00:21:26,300
like that we think immigrants or
even migrants and you think

411
00:21:26,300 --> 00:21:29,700
unbanked towards it's not it's
the simple case of someone Even

412
00:21:29,700 --> 00:21:32,600
moving for work, taken a job in
a different organ.

413
00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:34,300
Different party organization, a
different country.

414
00:21:34,300 --> 00:21:36,200
And all of a sudden you've no
credit history to bring with

415
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:37,200
you, you know.
Yeah.

416
00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,900
Huge opportunity to be able to
be the person who were to

417
00:21:39,900 --> 00:21:41,700
provider that allows you to do
that.

418
00:21:42,500 --> 00:21:45,900
Yeah, sorry, Ali, Ali, Walsh
move from Galway to Sheffield

419
00:21:45,900 --> 00:21:49,200
and the UK to get his to get
pipit set up initially.

420
00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:51,900
He could get a freaking bank
account to get an apartment to

421
00:21:51,908 --> 00:21:53,100
pay red.
Yeah.

422
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,500
It's like, what the hell.
So, that was one of The

423
00:21:56,500 --> 00:22:00,300
Inspirations for starting a bit
because he was a migrant, you

424
00:22:00,300 --> 00:22:03,000
know, going from Ireland to the
UK to get a business off the

425
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:06,200
ground.
So, it was Nova credit.

426
00:22:06,300 --> 00:22:11,500
Is, I saw this when I was just
looking for the name of

427
00:22:11,500 --> 00:22:15,200
majority, right?
The migrant Bank in the US and

428
00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:19,000
Google search automatically
return for me and changed it to

429
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,600
Immigrant banks in the USA
instead of Migrant Banks, the

430
00:22:21,608 --> 00:22:24,200
USA and said, including results
for and Banks.

431
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,600
The u.s.a. the first thing that
came up was Nova credit listing.

432
00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:30,400
The best bank accounts for us
newcomers in 2022.

433
00:22:30,500 --> 00:22:33,200
Yeah right.
So being able to create this

434
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:38,500
portable credit score for
yourself is fascinating and you

435
00:22:38,500 --> 00:22:41,300
know what I'm seeing and talking
about mobile money wallet as

436
00:22:41,300 --> 00:22:44,400
well.
Is that when you are when

437
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:48,100
someone is setting out to build
a credit score for you, they

438
00:22:48,100 --> 00:22:53,000
need to be able to dip into the
data that is representative of

439
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:55,700
your true Financial.
Life not just your bank account

440
00:22:55,700 --> 00:22:58,200
and if that is a mobile money
wallet, if that is a crypto

441
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,900
wallet, right?
So here's a challenge.

442
00:23:00,900 --> 00:23:04,300
I'll throw out for anybody.
Is that for example I had to

443
00:23:04,308 --> 00:23:07,500
download my, you know,
transactions off coinbase for

444
00:23:07,700 --> 00:23:09,100
tax.
Reporting going through all my

445
00:23:09,100 --> 00:23:12,500
us tax reporting this year.
A my Irish want as well and it

446
00:23:12,500 --> 00:23:14,800
was there was a lot of noise in
there, right?

447
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,000
A lot of different transactions
converting between different

448
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,900
cryptocurrencies and you know
inbounds out bounds whatever and

449
00:23:20,900 --> 00:23:23,200
it was like all right.
How is my accountant going to

450
00:23:23,208 --> 00:23:27,500
actually make A sense of that.
So I there are apps, like, I

451
00:23:27,508 --> 00:23:29,200
think tactic is called one of
them.

452
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:31,100
Crypto taxes, another.
I think they were actually in a

453
00:23:31,100 --> 00:23:34,900
fintech 250 that do this, right?
And they will take this data,

454
00:23:34,900 --> 00:23:37,100
download it from coinbase and
they will actually, you know,

455
00:23:37,100 --> 00:23:41,400
turn it into tax reporting.
But what about ciphering through

456
00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:47,800
that for figuring out, someone
spending habits Just like some

457
00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:50,400
of the better players like an
over credit or whomever have

458
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:52,200
figured out.
Here's how we're actually going

459
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,500
to sort through, not only bank
account data, but Marvel, money

460
00:23:54,500 --> 00:23:58,500
data, your Telecom, Bill your
heating bills, whatever, all

461
00:23:58,500 --> 00:24:00,900
this type of stuff.
Please.

462
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:04,300
How can you sort through my
crypto account to be able to

463
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:10,300
decipher what is representative
of a healthy Financial life,

464
00:24:10,700 --> 00:24:12,800
right?
So I'd love to see someone come

465
00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,700
up with a solution for that and
Joanna's you were talking to

466
00:24:15,700 --> 00:24:17,500
true.
It made me think and it maybe

467
00:24:17,500 --> 00:24:20,000
it's maybe not something we know
and I'd love to.

468
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:21,900
I'd love to have the
conversation, like, it'll be a

469
00:24:21,900 --> 00:24:24,700
great one for a panel or
something, you know, taking over

470
00:24:24,700 --> 00:24:26,700
credit or you take a plaid or
something like that.

471
00:24:26,700 --> 00:24:28,800
And you say, okay, well if
you're plugged in and you're the

472
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,200
Connecting Point like Nova
credit is a good example there,

473
00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:34,500
20 bureaus that they partner
with so obviously they're you

474
00:24:34,508 --> 00:24:39,200
know, they're selling into Banks
but are they structurally now

475
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:41,100
getting to the point that
they're important to the

476
00:24:41,100 --> 00:24:44,300
industry that you couldn't
necessarily allow someone to

477
00:24:44,300 --> 00:24:48,200
just acquire them.
Yeah then you know they just BC

478
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:52,700
were acquiring them.
Does that lesson the you know

479
00:24:52,700 --> 00:24:56,600
the potential of what they're
doing for the the industry it

480
00:24:56,600 --> 00:25:00,300
does, it's an industry utility
and I've had this conversation

481
00:25:00,300 --> 00:25:02,900
with other folks before is that
when you're building something

482
00:25:02,900 --> 00:25:06,800
that you want to be an industry,
utility obviously utility brings

483
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,100
with it, a certain connotations
about maybe not Venture style

484
00:25:09,100 --> 00:25:11,500
returns, right?
Because who's going to buy them,

485
00:25:11,900 --> 00:25:13,800
right?
Yeah, unless they eventually go

486
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,300
public and when you are a public
utility Ility, it's doesn't

487
00:25:17,300 --> 00:25:21,300
scream, you know, fat, you know,
Jaws effect, tight margins,

488
00:25:21,300 --> 00:25:26,200
right?
So yeah, totally agree, but I'd

489
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,100
love to hear who would take a
dissenting voice on that and say

490
00:25:29,100 --> 00:25:32,000
no actually what could a big
Bank do with this?

491
00:25:32,100 --> 00:25:36,000
Could they actually take once
big step ahead and kind of

492
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:40,800
corner their ability to provide
the best risk management type

493
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:43,500
approach to learning?
Yeah.

494
00:25:43,500 --> 00:25:46,900
Because if you think like the
Visa, Plaid acquisition had to

495
00:25:46,900 --> 00:25:50,000
go gut, you know, pushback from
the Department of Justice in the

496
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:56,300
US, but yes, the who was ignored
again, got acquired big open,

497
00:25:56,300 --> 00:25:57,800
but you keep coming back to
this.

498
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:00,800
No, but it'll give you, if you
draw, you can draw parallels

499
00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:04,500
between, you know, day of 3200,
banking partners that they're

500
00:26:04,500 --> 00:26:08,100
providing open banking solutions
for you know.

501
00:26:08,100 --> 00:26:13,200
Can you allow can the regulator
allow one player to acquire them

502
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:17,200
could the regulator allow one
Player to acquire Nova credit

503
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:20,800
and Corner Demarcus or control
accent.

504
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,500
You know.
Is I, is that not a monopoly

505
00:26:23,500 --> 00:26:25,600
question?
I think.

506
00:26:25,900 --> 00:26:28,600
Yes, but are the regulator's?
When they're looking at these

507
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:30,400
decision, when they're looking
at, you know, these and Blatt

508
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:33,100
for example, were they thinking
will platter kind of a public

509
00:26:33,100 --> 00:26:36,400
utility or are exactly doing it.
That direction is that the way

510
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:38,400
they looked at this?
I don't think so.

511
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,200
No I don't think they have that
foresight to be able to do that.

512
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,600
I think they're they're looking
and saying you know, probably

513
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:45,100
from your angle.
Well you know.

514
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:50,000
What is this the same thing?
Now that I'm my my brain wave is

515
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:54,900
jumping two sandwiches ahead of
my mouth so that you know The

516
00:26:54,900 --> 00:26:59,300
Regulators looking at Visa plaid
and saying well plaid obviously

517
00:26:59,300 --> 00:27:02,900
has connectivity with so many
different financial institutions

518
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:07,300
by Visa buying them does that
then allow visa to Corner the

519
00:27:07,300 --> 00:27:10,400
market in terms of connectivity
with financial institutions and

520
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,700
perhaps, get a leg up on
MasterCard, American Express,

521
00:27:13,700 --> 00:27:15,500
squeeze its discovers, you know,
right?

522
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:16,700
Right if they're still out
there.

523
00:27:16,700 --> 00:27:20,300
So probably looking at it from
that angle, which is a close

524
00:27:20,300 --> 00:27:23,700
cousin of looking at plat as a
public utility that should just

525
00:27:23,700 --> 00:27:26,000
be an independent utility,
right?

526
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:30,000
But you know, let's see what
happens with plaid stripe.

527
00:27:30,100 --> 00:27:32,800
True layer.
You know, all these other

528
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,900
players.
What was the one tank in Europe

529
00:27:35,900 --> 00:27:39,800
that we've talked about recently
and see how, you know, should

530
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,800
they just all merge together?
Strike would say, no, I don't

531
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:44,800
call us brothers and say,
because they're looking at this

532
00:27:44,900 --> 00:27:46,600
whole Space bit.
Early, right?

533
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,000
I think I want to go down this
Rabbit Hole a bit further.

534
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:50,700
So I'll come back to you on this
topic.

535
00:27:50,900 --> 00:27:52,600
Please do.
Now, I'd love it.

536
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,400
If you would and we'll come up
with something out on this.

537
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,600
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556
00:29:02,300 --> 00:29:05,600
Couple more that I I picked up
on because we talk so much about

557
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:11,200
Marcus and shout out to Pat
fintech because I am doing some

558
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,400
educational delivery for them as
we talked about last year, I

559
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,200
don't feel like I'm lecturing
some trying to get people

560
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:17,900
involved.
I don't feel like I'm teaching

561
00:29:17,900 --> 00:29:21,200
because I don't think I'm a very
good teacher but I am part of

562
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,400
the guests faculty so I'm fuck
halting.

563
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:30,500
Write it so that and in the
deck, Jack I that I use I

564
00:29:30,500 --> 00:29:33,000
feature this page talking about
traditional financial

565
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:37,700
institutions versus fintechs.
And one of the pages has Goldman

566
00:29:37,700 --> 00:29:40,200
Sachs listed on there as being
an old-school financial

567
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:43,200
institution.
Average age is 100 years but

568
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,300
there's a little footnote that I
put at the bottom of the slide.

569
00:29:45,300 --> 00:29:48,700
It says if they're Marcus app
which is their investment and

570
00:29:48,700 --> 00:29:51,200
sit where the savings and
investment is any indication,

571
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,600
hopefully they'll be the one
that actually survives with

572
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:55,100
this.
And they've done had done really

573
00:29:55,100 --> 00:29:57,900
well and bringing Marcus to
Market expanding it then.

574
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,300
They're investing app, but what
it looks like now is that it's

575
00:30:01,300 --> 00:30:05,600
getting a bit shaky and that
they're pulling back and only

576
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,200
offering Marcus accounts.
Now, I think two employees and

577
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:11,400
then corporates that are also
wealth management or sorry,

578
00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:14,900
wealth management customers
because it's expensive to run

579
00:30:14,900 --> 00:30:16,300
this.
I think they spent 100 early

580
00:30:16,300 --> 00:30:17,600
analysis.
I think it's something like

581
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:20,100
that.
Yeah, and that when you have a

582
00:30:20,100 --> 00:30:22,900
big, huge banking institution,
running a fintech.

583
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,500
It's hard to say to someone.
Okay.

584
00:30:25,500 --> 00:30:29,600
Your Chief product officer has
left so So I need the CTO and

585
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,500
the co o to kind of split their
duties to save some money

586
00:30:32,500 --> 00:30:34,000
because we're running out of
Runway here.

587
00:30:34,100 --> 00:30:37,700
So the next, you know, six
months because you don't you

588
00:30:37,708 --> 00:30:40,500
just Lop someone else in there
and pull them out because that's

589
00:30:40,500 --> 00:30:41,800
the difference in the financial
model.

590
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:44,800
So, you're spending a huge
amount in the anticipation, to

591
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:46,800
be able to get a huge amount of
customers on what, which they

592
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,600
did, right?
They got loads of customers well

593
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:54,500
over 100 million I think and but
interest rates are going up,

594
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:57,600
right?
And you know, more expensive

595
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:01,700
with and Patient finance things.
So the pressure is on Marcus and

596
00:31:01,700 --> 00:31:03,500
it looks like they may not
survive.

597
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,300
So yeah, so I know just loads of
commentaries on room but I saw

598
00:31:07,300 --> 00:31:11,900
someone say that all those
McKinsey and all those post-grad

599
00:31:11,900 --> 00:31:14,900
MBA students be crying into
their into their books now

600
00:31:14,900 --> 00:31:19,300
because this is the ideal case
study Innovation by a big bank

601
00:31:19,300 --> 00:31:20,800
and now looks like it's gonna
work out.

602
00:31:21,300 --> 00:31:26,400
It is it is no and I saw what I
thought was a McKinsey or BCG

603
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:28,000
style deck for a fantastic
glass.

604
00:31:28,100 --> 00:31:31,200
Last week or a couple weeks ago
and I'm like, oh dear, oh dear.

605
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:32,800
No, let's just focus on the 10
pages.

606
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,600
It really matter, it took to
know what it's the one that we

607
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:37,500
should have expected wasn't
going to work out before,

608
00:31:37,500 --> 00:31:40,300
whatever reason, I believe that
it was they seem to be putting

609
00:31:40,300 --> 00:31:45,200
everything behind it and
spending, yeah to spending a

610
00:31:45,208 --> 00:31:47,700
bunch of money on it and then
eventually you got to look at a

611
00:31:47,708 --> 00:31:51,000
business unit and say, is it
profitable or not, right?

612
00:31:51,100 --> 00:31:53,700
And make some make some
decisions around it on what to

613
00:31:53,700 --> 00:31:56,200
do because you know, money
doesn't grow on trees.

614
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:58,000
Yeah.
Contrary to popular.

615
00:31:58,100 --> 00:32:00,800
Belief in some circles.
So yeah, that was that one.

616
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:04,200
The other one in trouble,
obviously Banknorth there.

617
00:32:04,300 --> 00:32:06,300
Looks like they're on there
while they definitely are on

618
00:32:06,300 --> 00:32:08,600
their last legs.
They're selling their SME

619
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:13,500
lending business to L, HV, L HV,
R in Estonian bank.

620
00:32:13,500 --> 00:32:16,000
They have a UK Branch now as
well.

621
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:20,000
So I think it was like, some
some like 17 million pounds

622
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,600
worth of an open loan book which
would be good for LH V, LH V, or

623
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:25,500
the Fiat on ran for coinbase in
Europe.

624
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:26,700
Okay.
All right.

625
00:32:26,700 --> 00:32:30,000
So, you know, when I I send my
money to from revolute to

626
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:32,700
coinbase goes through, lhv
first, and then instantaneously,

627
00:32:32,700 --> 00:32:35,700
it's in my coinbase account.
So, but lhv took a stake in

628
00:32:35,700 --> 00:32:37,700
Banknorth last year, didn't they
5 Min?

629
00:32:37,700 --> 00:32:40,300
I don't remember.
Yeah, I'm just looking at here.

630
00:32:40,300 --> 00:32:42,700
Yeah, four and a half million.
So I mean, they obviously knew

631
00:32:42,700 --> 00:32:45,800
the business.
Well, the SME lending piece

632
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:49,000
seems to fit which what I'll HV
do anyway and they're applying

633
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,800
for their own license and a tree
is applying for its banking

634
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,300
licence in the UK it submitted
earlier this year.

635
00:32:54,300 --> 00:32:57,500
So it probably helps strengthen
that case in that respect.

636
00:32:58,000 --> 00:32:58,300
Yeah.
Yeah.

637
00:32:58,300 --> 00:33:00,500
So I was always a fan of
Banknorth.

638
00:33:00,500 --> 00:33:03,600
I think it was someone from 11 a
fast who said that if Jon Snow

639
00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:06,500
from Game of Thrones was to have
any bank account, it would be

640
00:33:06,500 --> 00:33:10,700
Banknorth.
Obviously with roots coming

641
00:33:10,700 --> 00:33:12,700
support.
Winter is coming like that.

642
00:33:12,700 --> 00:33:14,900
Now, I wish I never had, you
know, never had the pleasure of

643
00:33:14,900 --> 00:33:16,400
having a Banknorth account
anyway.

644
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,100
And 26 also post a big loss
there, saying they will be able

645
00:33:20,100 --> 00:33:23,300
to get the profitability.
I saw that pop up and, you know,

646
00:33:23,300 --> 00:33:25,700
the thank you for this final
one.

647
00:33:25,700 --> 00:33:28,100
I wanted to mention to Dave
Cunningham, big shout out to To

648
00:33:28,100 --> 00:33:29,500
David.
He tweeted this.

649
00:33:29,500 --> 00:33:32,900
I think it was yesterday or this
morning but putting the meth in

650
00:33:32,900 --> 00:33:38,100
metaverse.
I love that So Meta announces

651
00:33:38,100 --> 00:33:40,200
legs in there.
What is it called?

652
00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:42,300
Horizon, worlds, metaverse or
something.

653
00:33:42,300 --> 00:33:44,400
And it was like, there were so
excited.

654
00:33:44,700 --> 00:33:47,400
Mark, Zuckerberg Avatar was
jumping up and down.

655
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:50,200
It still looks like a 1990s
video game version of Mark

656
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:51,100
Zuckerberg, what?
Yeah.

657
00:33:51,500 --> 00:33:54,800
Just ridiculous.
It was a TechCrunch article that

658
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:59,600
made the rounds and that there
was no mention In of and FTS,

659
00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:03,500
when they talked about, how you
could buy digital Assets in this

660
00:34:03,600 --> 00:34:07,200
Meta, Meta verse, which is the
whole point, right?

661
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:10,900
And being able to buy virtual
Goods that you can then take

662
00:34:10,900 --> 00:34:14,600
with you in a wallet and bring
to other Virtual Worlds, right?

663
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:17,600
You don't want to go by your
Nike sneakers in meta Horizon

664
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,100
worlds and then only be able to
wear them there, you want to be

665
00:34:21,100 --> 00:34:23,900
able to wear them at the Central
and sandbox and crypto voxels

666
00:34:23,900 --> 00:34:26,300
and realm, which is a pretty
cool one.

667
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,300
Shout out to mount larabee.
And but that's it.

668
00:34:30,500 --> 00:34:34,199
So they all of this negative
connotation that we're getting

669
00:34:34,199 --> 00:34:37,600
from the community around meta
building this and building a

670
00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:43,000
closed metaverse is, you know,
we see this all planned out

671
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:45,199
because it's just not the way to
do it.

672
00:34:45,300 --> 00:34:47,500
If you follow the model of
gregarious games, which is

673
00:34:47,507 --> 00:34:50,800
totally fictional, by the way,
which only exists in the book.

674
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:54,800
Ready Player, One, you basically
build the platform for the

675
00:34:54,808 --> 00:34:57,100
metaverse and build the
framework for these metaverse

676
00:34:57,100 --> 00:34:58,900
world and let people On top of
it.

677
00:34:59,500 --> 00:35:04,600
And in this story people built,
you know, a planet dedicated to

678
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,400
Prince, Right?
The artist formerly known as

679
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:13,800
Prince and God, Rest his soul
and a city or Planet dedicated

680
00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,800
to John Hughes who did The
Sixteen Candles and Breakfast

681
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,300
Club and what was it?
Pretty and pink movies back in

682
00:35:19,300 --> 00:35:23,000
the 80s and a few others.
And so again, I'm talking about

683
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,100
science fiction, as if it's
actually fact and it's not but

684
00:35:26,500 --> 00:35:29,600
science fiction informs.
It's reality Bishop, she's

685
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:31,000
right.
So look II.

686
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:34,500
Just don't see Meta is it pains
me to still call them better?

687
00:35:34,500 --> 00:35:39,300
Because their Facebook doing
this in a way that is in a not

688
00:35:39,300 --> 00:35:42,000
in alignment because this stuff
doesn't exist yet.

689
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:46,400
But with the true nature of
being able to enjoy part of your

690
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,400
life in this virtual world, it
can't be your whole life because

691
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:51,500
then you'd be, I don't know, I
don't know what happened.

692
00:35:51,500 --> 00:35:54,700
You turn into Terminator, but,
you know, being able to enjoy

693
00:35:54,700 --> 00:35:57,900
part of your life in this
virtual world, I don't see.

694
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:00,100
Happening with what meta is
building.

695
00:36:00,100 --> 00:36:03,900
I just don't well, because I
know they also announced our

696
00:36:06,100 --> 00:36:10,700
Quest Pro their latest headset
for your headset and ability to

697
00:36:10,700 --> 00:36:14,200
do, obviously far more with it.
And I just wonder, I suppose,

698
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:17,700
you know, we're talking about
communities earlier on and, you

699
00:36:17,700 --> 00:36:20,100
know, we talked about the
metaverse and how, at the

700
00:36:20,100 --> 00:36:23,600
moment, the kind of real
versions that are out there in

701
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:25,700
gaming like Fortnight and Roblox
and stuff.

702
00:36:25,700 --> 00:36:31,600
So you wonder Are, you know, he
has obviously a captive audience

703
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:35,400
to degree and he they're
building out the metaverse and

704
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,000
they're building out obviously
the functionality and then

705
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:39,900
they're offering the headsets
and everything.

706
00:36:39,900 --> 00:36:44,300
So you know, you would, you
would think naturally that the

707
00:36:44,300 --> 00:36:47,800
smartest way to get people is to
try bring some of those games

708
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:53,600
into The metaverse or more bring
use gaming as the, as the way to

709
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:57,200
kind of get people engaged as
opposed to socially because, you

710
00:36:57,207 --> 00:36:59,800
know, there's a very different
age profile of people playing

711
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:03,600
Fortnight versus people on
Facebook but yeah, somewhere in

712
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:05,500
the middle.
Would seem to be the answer.

713
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:09,900
Yeah it's there.
I think the I think they're

714
00:37:10,900 --> 00:37:13,600
they're metaverse.
The Meta Meta verse will be like

715
00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:17,200
the VCR, right?
It's something that was only a

716
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:22,000
holdover from Jesus, what was
there before VCRs?

717
00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:25,700
That I don't think there was
anything was there was that the

718
00:37:25,700 --> 00:37:29,000
Super 8, right?
So you could actually my dad had

719
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:32,000
a Super 8 camera and you could
then watch home movies

720
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:33,900
obviously.
But I think there was also a way

721
00:37:33,900 --> 00:37:37,700
to order movies as a Super 8 and
show that on your projector at

722
00:37:37,700 --> 00:37:41,400
home there, the I don't remember
from my childhood that us ever

723
00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,600
doing that, but it's something
is tickling at me that that was

724
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:49,000
an option and you know, so VCR
was the first real

725
00:37:49,300 --> 00:37:54,400
Commercialized big ability to
take movies home, okay?

726
00:37:54,700 --> 00:37:58,500
And then that existed for, you
know, 15 years they still do

727
00:37:58,500 --> 00:38:02,900
exist but they're not in use
pretty much at all and the, you

728
00:38:02,900 --> 00:38:06,700
know, the DVD took over and now
the DVD hits gonna gone by the

729
00:38:06,700 --> 00:38:08,700
wayside and streaming is the way
to do it.

730
00:38:08,700 --> 00:38:10,700
And then something's going to
happen to streaming at some

731
00:38:10,700 --> 00:38:14,100
stage.
But I see The Meta Meta verse

732
00:38:14,100 --> 00:38:17,900
being, you know like a VCR it's
going to be a way to get you

733
00:38:17,900 --> 00:38:21,900
know, people in But eventually,
there's going to be within 10

734
00:38:21,900 --> 00:38:23,700
years, there's going to be
something better.

735
00:38:23,700 --> 00:38:26,300
That is more open and people
just that people will float.

736
00:38:26,300 --> 00:38:29,200
I suppose you just, you know,
given how we talked about even

737
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,300
with watsapp they Rebel roll out
payments and all of a sudden

738
00:38:32,300 --> 00:38:35,400
it's a massive Revenue line
potentially and it opens up a

739
00:38:35,408 --> 00:38:38,700
big opportunity.
You know the reality is he has a

740
00:38:38,700 --> 00:38:43,000
huge audience and while it looks
stupid at the moment.

741
00:38:43,100 --> 00:38:45,800
You know, you don't have to
imagine, they'll figure it out,

742
00:38:46,700 --> 00:38:48,900
they're smart people, they will
if they're smart enough.

743
00:38:48,900 --> 00:38:53,400
He's Owing to force something.
But like I said, the the working

744
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,200
solution or the answer is out
there in the market, it's

745
00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:59,300
Fortnight.
It's you know, it's all there is

746
00:38:59,300 --> 00:39:03,300
the our learnings, you know,
being able to do concerts in a

747
00:39:03,300 --> 00:39:06,200
fortnight setting, you know,
wouldn't you wouldn't imagine.

748
00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:08,800
It would be that far of a jump
for meta to announce that

749
00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:11,500
they've signed whoever to do
their latest concert in the

750
00:39:11,500 --> 00:39:13,200
metaverse at some point in the
future.

751
00:39:13,900 --> 00:39:16,800
Yeah yeah.
I mean I've got angel and devil

752
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,700
on my shoulders here to look at
both sides.

753
00:39:18,700 --> 00:39:22,800
This right?
And that, I think that in a

754
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:26,700
parallel to what's called
Enterprise blockchain, which

755
00:39:26,700 --> 00:39:30,200
some people look at, and say,
well, you know, it's closed.

756
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:35,400
It's it's permissioned in
contrast to public

757
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:39,700
permissionless.
Open blockchains in use by, you

758
00:39:39,700 --> 00:39:42,900
know, that are part of Bitcoin
that are part of the theorem.

759
00:39:42,900 --> 00:39:47,000
And obviously, any big, you
know, crypto asset and that.

760
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:49,100
You know what we're seeing?
Is that?

761
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:53,700
That big Financial players
JPMorgan Swift, right?

762
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:58,300
And the dtcc in the US, the
Clearinghouse all have big

763
00:39:58,300 --> 00:40:01,200
projects going around this, but
they're all closed blockchains,

764
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:03,800
just like matter or building a
closed metaverse.

765
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:07,900
And but there are very very
smart people.

766
00:40:07,900 --> 00:40:11,400
Working on these projects with
JPMorgan, edtc C, and Swift.

767
00:40:11,700 --> 00:40:15,300
Then I think they realize where
this is all going because

768
00:40:15,300 --> 00:40:17,900
they're not the only ones that
to get a product like this, or

769
00:40:17,900 --> 00:40:20,800
get something like this to Kit.
You need to do it in a way that

770
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:22,800
people will feel safe.
Right?

771
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,800
And the way to do it safely is
to close it and then if they are

772
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:29,800
indeed, genuinely truly
architecting it so that it can

773
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,500
be opened.
Good.

774
00:40:33,100 --> 00:40:36,700
But still You just adding legs
to the Avatar.

775
00:40:36,700 --> 00:40:41,400
Now, something, we're a bit
away.

776
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:45,400
Yes, we are.
We are so the again, the Matthew

777
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:48,800
ball book, The metaverse and how
it will revolutionize everything

778
00:40:49,100 --> 00:40:51,700
points to 2032 is the year,
right?

779
00:40:51,700 --> 00:40:53,900
Which is basically 10 years from
the book, it was published.

780
00:40:53,900 --> 00:40:56,500
So, you know, someone's gonna
write another book in two years

781
00:40:56,500 --> 00:40:59,500
from now, that will say, well,
it will arrive in, you know,

782
00:40:59,500 --> 00:41:02,400
2034, right?
So, we'll see.

783
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:04,500
But I think we won't even know.
It's oh, no doubt.

784
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:06,900
We well we won't even know it.
We won't even know it.

785
00:41:06,900 --> 00:41:10,300
It's just gonna slowly not
slowly but rapidly evolved.

786
00:41:10,300 --> 00:41:12,100
And it's going to be all of a
sudden it's going to be in front

787
00:41:12,100 --> 00:41:14,100
of us, you know?
And you having this conversation

788
00:41:14,100 --> 00:41:16,500
with our avatars.
Exactly exactly.

789
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:18,500
So I think we can.
That'll that'll be fun.

790
00:41:18,500 --> 00:41:20,600
That'll be fun.
I won't need it where a deed is

791
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:24,800
track seat for that, but Anyway,
shoutout to Adidas.

792
00:41:24,900 --> 00:41:27,600
See if we can get them as a
sponsor right sponsorship yet,

793
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:29,200
okay?
All right.

794
00:41:29,300 --> 00:41:31,500
Anything else?
You wanted to any more public

795
00:41:31,500 --> 00:41:35,000
complaints?
Any any complaints?

796
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:37,100
No, no, no, no assume.
Interesting.

797
00:41:37,100 --> 00:41:39,500
Stuff been looking at this week.
Reading a great book, actually,

798
00:41:40,100 --> 00:41:41,600
which I can't get the name,
right?

799
00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:45,300
You one second, The Importance
of Being interested by Robin ins

800
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:49,400
adventures in scientific
curiosity Importance of Being

801
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,500
interesting.
He's actually a comedian and

802
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:56,400
Presenter on a number of shows
on the BBC but fascinated in

803
00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:58,500
science and a reformed
scientist.

804
00:41:58,500 --> 00:42:02,300
I think is how he described
insulted amusing, take on, kind

805
00:42:02,300 --> 00:42:07,200
of Science and everything.
So, all right, The Importance of

806
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:09,300
Being interesting, their
Importance, of Being interested

807
00:42:09,300 --> 00:42:12,300
to being interested, interested.
Yes.

808
00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:14,900
All right.
I will collect that one for the

809
00:42:14,900 --> 00:42:19,500
show notes and just in that Tim
Ferriss and bright Armstrong

810
00:42:19,500 --> 00:42:22,100
podcast episode just out of
that.

811
00:42:22,900 --> 00:42:25,700
Surely you're joking.
Mr. Feynman was mentioned which

812
00:42:25,700 --> 00:42:26,600
I do.
Yeah.

813
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:28,700
I'm dying to get he supposed to
be excellent.

814
00:42:28,700 --> 00:42:33,600
Richard Fineman I have to get
this book Network state by

815
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:37,800
Balaji sreenivasan which I heard
about on a the same podcast and

816
00:42:37,808 --> 00:42:40,400
that I need to read we talked a
little bit about this few

817
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:44,400
episodes ago Ender's Game which
is was actually wasn't on that

818
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:47,500
podcast episode.
It was packing McCormick was

819
00:42:47,500 --> 00:42:51,000
saying in that latest essay that
one of the latest essays, he

820
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:52,500
wrote about being a father that
he's going.

821
00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:55,300
To get his kids reading Ender's
Game early, which is a classic

822
00:42:55,300 --> 00:42:58,500
sci-fi book changing world
order.

823
00:42:59,100 --> 00:43:01,500
So principles for a changing
World Order which is Ray dalio

824
00:43:01,500 --> 00:43:04,900
his newest book, which I think
could be a companion book to

825
00:43:05,500 --> 00:43:07,700
network State.
Be interesting to read those to

826
00:43:07,700 --> 00:43:10,000
one after the other to see how
that comes out.

827
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:13,000
And then hackers and Painters by
Paul Graham who's at start up

828
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,900
though, because we go to ride.
So I'm going to check out each

829
00:43:15,900 --> 00:43:18,900
one of those but few interesting
ones, that's our book list for

830
00:43:18,900 --> 00:43:21,300
the, for the year, for much, for
the year.

831
00:43:21,300 --> 00:43:23,700
Yeah, I'll be all set.
Ray time getting through pages

832
00:43:23,700 --> 00:43:25,900
at the moment.
It's pretty, you know, I know

833
00:43:25,900 --> 00:43:28,300
thanks again month olds but you
know they'll be there good for

834
00:43:28,300 --> 00:43:31,000
it.
They're good for cool.

835
00:43:31,500 --> 00:43:34,400
Well thank you Owen, pleasure.
Good night on this fine evening

836
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:36,300
cooking and we will chat
shortly.

837
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:47,500
Absolutely adios.
That is it for this week, folks,

838
00:43:47,500 --> 00:43:49,300
you can learn more about the
stories we covered in the show,

839
00:43:49,300 --> 00:43:51,000
notes on our website money never
sleeps that.

840
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:54,100
I also thank secona, Brophy from
creates on, for mixing and

841
00:43:54,100 --> 00:43:57,400
editing this podcast Conan is an
excellent medium and get in

842
00:43:57,400 --> 00:43:58,900
touch with when you're thinking
about launching your own

843
00:43:58,900 --> 00:44:01,500
podcast.
As for me, I'm an early stage,

844
00:44:01,500 --> 00:44:03,800
startup investor focused on
where fintech meets crypto and

845
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:06,200
crypto meets web three there
plenty of links in the show

846
00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:08,500
notes on money, never sleeps
that IE on how to get in touch

847
00:44:08,500 --> 00:44:12,200
with us so don't hesitate to
reach out finally till next

848
00:44:12,200 --> 00:44:14,000
time, thanks for listening.
See you